5. 'All these Samanas and Brahmanas,'--so said the venerable Nanda,--'say that purity comes from (philosophical) views, and from tradition, and from virtue and (holy) works, and in many (other) ways; if thou, O Muni, sayest that such have not crossed the stream, who then in the world of gods and men crossed over birth and old age, O venerable man? I ask thee, O Bhagavat, tell me this.' (1080)

6. 'I do not say that all Samanas and Brahmanas, O Nanda,'--so said Bhagavat,--'are shrouded by birth and old age; those who, after leaving in this world what has been seen or heard or thought, and all virtue and (holy) works, after leaving everything of various kinds, after penetrating desire, are free from passion, such indeed I call men that have crossed the stream[1].' (1081)

[1. Naham 'sabbe samanabrahmanase
Gatigaraya nivuta' ti brumi,
Ye s' idha dittham va sutam mutam va
Silabbatam vapi pahaya sabbam
Anekarupam pi pahaya sabbam
Tanham parinnaya anasavase
Te ve nara oghatinna ti brumi.]

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7. Nanda: 'I delight in these words of the great Isi; well expounded (by thee), O Gotama, is freedom from upadhi (i.e. Nibbana); those who, after leaving in this world what has been seen or heard or thought, and all virtue and (holy) works, after leaving everything of various kinds, after penetrating desire, are free from passion, such I call men that have crossed the stream.' (1082)

Nandamanavapukkha is ended.

9. HEMAKAMANAVAPUKKHA.

1. 'Those who before in another world,'--so said the venerable Hemaka,--'explained to me the doctrine of Gotama, saying, "So it was, so it will be," all that (was only) oral tradition, all that (was only) something that increased (my) doubts[1]. (1083)

2. 'I took no pleasure in that, but tell thou me the Dhamma that destroys desire, O Muni, which if a man has understood, and he wanders about thoughtful, he may cross desire in the world.' (1084)

3. Buddha: 'In this world (much) has been seen,

[1. Ye me pubbe viyakamsu
Huram Gotamasasanam
Ikk-asi iti bhavissati
Sabban tam itihitiham
Sabban tam takkavaddhanam.]

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heard, and thought; the destruction of passion and of wish for the dear objects that have been perceived, O Hemaka, is the imperishable state of Nibbana. (1085)

4. 'Those who, having understood this, are thoughtful, calm, because they have seen the Dhamma, tranquil and divine, such have crossed desire in this world[1].' (1086)

Hemakamanavapukkha is ended.

10. TODEYYAMANAVAPUKKHA.

1. 'He in whom there live no lusts,'--so said the venerable Todeyya,--'to whom there is no desire, and who has overcome doubt, what sort of deliverance is there for him?' (1087)